NRCG Fall Meeting 2002
Meeting Notes
Present: Bob Fry, Mark Stanley, Jim Greene, Roberta Whitlock, Peg Geiger, Neil Nelson, Mike Santucci, Andy Randall, Rodd Richardson, Sandy Evenson, Mike Plattes, Jack Kirkendall, Joe Wulfkuhle, Rick Grady, Bryan Swift, John Specht, Bob Rebarchik, Mark Woods, Peggy Polichio, Paul Mock, Tim Murphy, Brett Waters, Tom Boatner, Paul Chamberlin, Brian Shiplett, Jess Mickelson, Tracey Nimlos, Phil Gil, Chris Shelton, Ken Castro.
Business Committee – Roberta Whitlock handed out accomplishments for the Business Committee for 2002 (see handout). Peg handed out goals and objectives for next year for committee. ACTION ITEMS
Training Committee – Neil Nelson, committee meets next week, look at redoing training program guide, Fire Leadership Course. ACTION ITEM
1. Interagency Contracting/Training position at NRCC
Operations Committee – John Specht handed out minutes from meeting last week. Mark Romey will be new chair; vice-chair will come from E MT zone. There are 3 items that require ACTION from NRCG.
NRCC will maintain 2 lists this year for Engine rotation, one for structural engines and one for wildland engines. Engine Typing matrix in the Incident Pocket Guide is the correct one to use.
Would like Equipment/Business committee to develop specs and rates for AARR
Equipment Committee – Rick Grady handed out draft charter and membership list along with list of tasks they were assigned by the Business Committee. Plan to accomplish these tasks by the end of February. Would like to see 2 equipment inspection workshops next year. Had trouble filling inspection teams in 2002. ACTION ITEMS
Fire Use Committee – Paul Mock, Fire Use committee was active in spirit. Did a lot of networking via telephone. Goals for next year: will have some work to do with cross-billing between agencies, need to recruit some new members, need to define for all agencies what Fire Use is, whatever we can do to support collaborative fuels reduction. Will have a conference call next month. ACTION ITEMS
Big change is putting responsibility on training provider to supply operating plan stating exactly what courses they will put on and who the instructors will be, whether or not they will issue task books and red cards and who will issue them. Would like decision by BOD as to whether to implement this update.
Who is going to monitor these MOUs?
When are we going to say we have enough MOUs?
Can local mob boards provide oversight?
Who is going to certify if the trainers are qualified.
DECISIONS:
DRIVING, CONTRACTOR CREWS, ETC.
Do we need to develop a list of guidelines for the mob guide on mobilizing and demobing resources, driving time, how we feed them, what type of transportation, qualifications of drivers, etc.
Maybe develop a checklist of criteria to use for transporting crews. Dispatch meeting will talk about what we need to put into the mob guide.
NRCG MIFF Committee will be meeting next week in Billings for the first time.
CONTRACTOR ISSUES:
Firechasing
Sub-par equipment
Rates in different geographic areas
Contractors in overhead position name requesting their own company
Inspection teams
Competition with local departments
Oversight of contract resources
Decision was made to forward these issues to the national level at the NWCG Lessons Learned meeting in Nov.
RAWS COORDINATOR – Bruce Thoricht
Maintenance of RAWS stations is very out of date. Field personnel may not know WIMS or ASCADS sp? Properly. Bruce is trying to visit a percentage of the stations each year to evaluation location and condition of them. One option for more climatically sensitive areas is to have FTS maintain station. Cost is about $7500 per station. Should consider moving some surplus stations into more data sparse areas. Bruce has requested funding from FS Air Quality Program.
PREDICTIVE SERVICES UPDATE – Steve Stoll gave report on unit’s accomplishments for the past year including the fire day assessment, 7-day assessments, briefings to MAC group, daily briefings to the smokejumpers and aviation group, heads ups to dispatch centers, NRCC briefings, connection made with land management agencies in ND to work on support for those areas, oversight of RAWS program, smoke management, State of the Fuels Program, and Fire Weather Fuels Delivery Information System (one-stop shopping for information). Priorities for ’03 include cross-training between fire weather program and smoke management, evaluate and improve present products and services, quality control and site evaluation of RAWS stations, prepare for implement move to new NRCC.
New Smoke Management Field Guide is now available and posted on the web.
ZONE REPORTS:
N ID – Peggy Polichio, below-average fire season by 1/3, FS burned 3500 acres, IDL burned 1600 acres, busy dispatch season mobbing people nationally, sent out 1200 people, 94 crews and 104 engines, IPF hosted 2 national contract crews that were exceptional, they had 5 dispatches. Low maintenance, professional and good workers. 24 WFU events on Clr/Nez, about 17,000 Rx acres burned within the zone. Contracting is number 1 issue w/in the zone. Workload for dispatch centers and contracting offices. Number 2 issue is filling IMTs within the zone. Possible solution is more incentive for people to make themselves available. Number 3 issue is Thirtymile, what good did it do at the local level. We need more oversight and help during multiple fire situations, not more paperwork. Retardant issue in the long-term at Grangeville is a concern. Ken Castro will be taking over as zone rep.
NW MT – Mark Stanley, availability of personnel for fire assignments and IMTs is a concern. Struggle with cooperation from counties during busy years. Confusion about Thirtymile guidelines, does it depend on jurisdiction, employer? Within the NR all agencies have agreed to follow Thirtymile Abatement Plan. Lack of consistency between 310-1 and 5109.17 causes problems. IOS Working Team is going to be reviewing the 310-1.
SW MT – Jack Kirkendall, no large fires this year, lots of IA, experienced about 2/3 of normal activity, increase in human-caused starts. New FMO on Lolo NF, Chuck Stanich. Biggest challenge this year was combination of SMICC and Missoula Dispatch into MIDC, Missoula Interagency Dispatch Center, with Sandy Evenson in place as Dispatch Coordinator. In 2003 MIDC will take over dispatching airtankers from NRCC and in 2004 will take over dispatching smokejumpers from NRCC. Biggest issue in zone is dealing with increased number of contractors. MIDC is going through a complete revision of the Mob Board. Bitterroot Dispatch Center and MIDC are working more closely together now. No issues to bring to NRCG other than those already mentioned.
CENTRAL MT – Mark Woods, below normal activity, but still a busy season. Thirtymile issue brought up point that NRCG direction needs to be followed up by agency administrator direction to make clear that all agencies agree. DNRC has been sponsoring local government employees for training and IMT participation. DNRC cannot continue to fund at the level it has grown to.
No advantage or need to coordinate at a zone level. Central MT zone operating plan is not signed. 3 interagency dispatch centers within the zone coordinate very well. At fall meeting may look at shrinking the Central zone. Each division of the zone has 10-12 cooperators and there are a total of 11 counties, makes the group too large. Zone can bring a proposal to NRCG for approval.
SOUTH CENTRAL MT – Bob Fry; issues include communications via radio, wide band vs. narrow band, ENGB qualifications for rural departments; can cause strife between cooperators. Engine academies are helpful to maintain these relationships. Now have a joint fire station with FS and county.
EASTERN MT ZONE – Phil Gil, started early with fairly heavy activity and finished with heavy activity at the end of the season. Hard drought continued with a little rain in the middle. Coordinating fire restrictions went very well this year. Developed a template that will work for the future. Concerned that some of the requirements of Thirtymile might actually distract people from what they should be doing because of extra paperwork. Another issue is work/rest guidelines. Managing the guidelines during heavy IA is difficult. We may be taking a 30% cut in IA capacity in order to follow work/rest guidelines. All agencies had a bad time with the April/May window for Rx burning. Used contractors heavily in non-traditional roles. Felt the effects of fewer MIFF crews. Are trying to do an interagency guard school next spring. Accomplished an interagency preparedness review within the zone.
Suggestion was made to involve congressional delegation when beefing up IA resources in an area in order to help them understand what we are doing to help private landowners.
For Lessons Learned NMAC session: Local departments will respond and commit to IA, but cannot meet all of our standards.
NORTH DAKOTA– Mike Santucci, fire season from 2001 just continued right through to 2002 with starts as early as February. Moisture came late so spring season lasted until June. The zone developed interagency IA modules with severity. Kraft Fire burned 35,000 acres. Zone put together and signed an annual operating plan. Initiated zone MAC group calls for the first time. Priorities for zone include Interagency Annual Operating Plan for zone, Preparedness Plan, SEAT program. Issues for NRCG include a reminder that fire season in the east begins in April and getting predictive services up and running in ND.
ACTION ITEM:
Send an NRCG letter to agency administrators thanking participation of employees in other geographic areas during last fire season.
HUMAN RESOURCE SPECIALIST PROGRAM UPDATE – Jan Everett
Trying to get the HRSP position sanctioned by NWCG. Trying hard to move this program away from “finders of civil rights” violations. Goal is to deal with Human Resources issues at the lowest level in fire camp. HRS is also there to take Human Resource workload off the IC but still keep him informed. Currently 14 fully qualified HRSP, would like to see closer to 20. Were able to get 7 trainees out on fire last season. There are 10 more trainees from the last course that have not yet had assignments. Jan handed out a copy of Request for NWCG Approval for Human Resource Specialist Position, which will be presented to NWCG by Jerry Williams. Please get any comments or suggestions to Jan about the proposal or the program in general. (406-329-4938 or jeverett@fs.fed.us). DECISION ITEM: Does NRCG want to send a letter to NWCG in support of the program?
GIS PROPOSAL – Jeff Scussel (DECISION ITEM)
This proposal has been a work in progress over the summer due to need for GIS services identified by IMTs. Need is for maps for IAPs and larger maps for Div Group Sups and Branch Directors, public information, etc.
Solutions are outlined in the handout with 3 options being presented. Proposal recommends option 2 with a team attached GIS tech, computer, high-speed plotter and software. Two options are also presented for training and meetings.
Another consideration is that these units not be attached to an IMT but remains in a pool to be available to all teams.
Asking NWCG to put together a contract at the national level for GIS support could take years. There was an attempt to develop a contract within the NR last year but they ran into many difficulties.
Maybe an assessment needs to be done of what field units can provide and whether host units can provide the support needed.
INCIDENT MEDICAL SPECIALIST PROGRAM – Jeff is working with them to convince them we are not practicing medicine, but performing first-aid. Jeff has informed them that this is not a Forest Service Program, but an NRCG program. He continues to work with the state medical board so they will allow this successful program to continue.
DNRC CASH FLOW/BUDGET UPDATE – Tim Murphy
DNRC is not funded for fire suppression, must ask legislature for special supplement to fund fire. Because of 3 heavy fire years in a row, DNRC started to realize they would have a cash flow problem. Because of local resources sent out of state this year the problem increased. Received payment from FS and BLM within the past couple of weeks, which helped alleviate the problem. Legislature will meet in January and they will go through supplemental appropriations and will hopefully make DNRC solvent again. Will propose legislation to increase Governor’s emergency fund and will try to get an annual appropriation for fire suppression. Will propose downsizing the county co-op program in Western MT to meet Governor’s request for a 5% budget reduction.
NMAC LESSONS LEARNED MEETING – Tom Boatner
A draft agenda is out and includes a proposal for national standards for FAST teams. Agree with a standard minimum reporting process, but do not support formalizing the framework of how teams are put together and how they work. Would also like to be informal on who orders the team.
Other agenda items include WFSUs, Preparedness Level Standards, Prepositioned IMTs, IMT management and oversight, MAC Group training. Stress the point that if teams are ordered and prepositioned, they should go to the top of the rotation. If a team is staged and they don’t get an assignment, they should not have to go to the bottom of the rotation.
WATER APPLICATION KITS – Paul Chamberlin
Safety program in general: finished sweep across the NR putting on LCES workshops. Developed the “Up the Ante” program to promote snag safety and sold it as a national emphasis topic to NWCG. Also suggested that driving be a national emphasis topic with NWCG. Paul sees a web based library of information on driving safety not only for fire, but driving in general. He hopes for NRCG’s endorsement for driving as an emphasis topic. Paul was on a national committee last year to develop a one-stop shopping web site for annual refresher training.
Organize water-handling equipment into 1000’ kits for hose
lay which includes all components needed.
Would like NRCG to ask the cache to put together some of these kits for
the upcoming fire season. Need to sell
this to the individuals placing the orders.
Paul will go to team meetings to sell this and also need to sell at
local FMO meetings. Could also go to a
Type II incident and walk them through ordering and using these kits. DECISION: Approved
OLD BUSINESS – Tracey Nimlos
ACTION ITEM UPDATE
10/2002
|
Action Item |
Assigned to |
Due Date |
Action Taken |
|
ACTION ITEM 2001-17 -- Hazard Tree Initiative Draft
Proposal. Send comments to Paul
Chamberlin by 1/15/02. He will send
final proposal to Tracey to distribute to BOD before NRCG spring meeting. |
Paul Chamberlin |
March 02 |
Finalized Spring 2002 |
|
ACTION ITEM 2001-18 – Task a group to go out during
fire season to inspect contractors for compliance with specs and check
training cards. Set target date for contractors to meet single
resource boss quals on Engines. Let contractors know they need to establish an
organization to police themselves. |
Business, Ops, Training Committees |
|
Need report from Business Committee. Done. See Decision Notices - 2002. Several Contractors’ Associations are already in place. |
|
ACTION ITEM 2001-19 -- Training package for agency
administrators and managers on restrictions/closures. Training notice will be distributed thru
NRCG BOD. |
Prevention/ Education Committee |
|
Training presented at spring 2002 session of "Fire Management Leadership for Line Officers". Training presented to every zone in June. Zone restrictions coordinators have the one-hour training presentation, which is available by request. |
|
ACTION ITEM 2001-21 – Workshop for Type III, IV, and
V ICs. Human factors, when to move to
extended attack, etc. Paul will put
session together and target timeframe for each zone. Tom will put a summary statement on NRCG
letterhead to send out notification. |
Paul Chamberlin Tom Boatner |
|
Paul visited and spoke with several units who were pursuing this on a local level. He will tie up loose ends this spring. |
|
ACTION ITEM 2001-23 – IARR and Crew Rep
Training. Plattes will advertise
training dates and BOD will encourage people to participate. Tom Corbin will draft a letter to
summarize importance of this program. |
Mike Plattes Tom Corbin |
|
IARR Training will be presented Nov. 6-7, 2002. Crew rep training not yet scheduled for this season. |
|
ACTION ITEM 2001-24 – Review Training MOUs to clean
up issues and questions. |
Training Committee |
Fall 2002 |
Assign to new Training NTE position?. |
|
ACTION ITEM 2001-25 – NFP screening group will
prepare a list of fuels projects to enable all agencies to
partner/coordinate. Present at spring
NRCG meeting. NRCG would like to see an interagency group summarize projects at each location, summarize grants available, contacts for each grant & application deadlines. |
Paula Rosenthal |
March 2002 |
The integrated interagency National Fire Plan database will soon be online.This is occurring on a local level. |
|
ACTION ITEM 2001-26 – Interagency Aviation
Organization--proposal to build one organization for the geographic area. |
Barry Hicks |
|
NRCG Aviation Committee Charter done August 2002. Membership is being pulled together. Need a rep from National Guard. |
|
(1999) RADIO
FREQUENCIES--The Voice and Data Task Force needs to identify (by agency if
possible) the issues and groups/agencies that will not be able to talk to
each other and what the ramifications of that will be. There will be safety
issues. We may not be able to affect the solution, but we can make agency
administrators aware of the problems we will be facing. |
Voice and Data Task Force |
Spring 2000 |
Need report from Tom
B. |
IMT ISSUES –
Tom attended joint Rocky Mountain/Great Basin Coordinating Group meeting and IMT issues came up that mirror our issues. Do we want to work together to fill IMTs, do we want to have a Type II team rotation together? Do we need fewer teams if we run a multiple geographic area rotation? Agreed the Operations Committee chairs from the 3 geographic areas would get together and talk about this.
Eastern Area is also interested in continuing our relationship with their employees on NR teams and possibly sharing a team.
John Specht passed out issues brought forward from the NR ICs.
NWCG is going to issue standard team configurations. If our teams are going to participate in national dispatches they will have to meet these guidelines.
ACTION ITEM: Tom will draft a letter and Tracey will get a group to do mailings thanking individuals for participating on IMTs this past fire season.
FUTURE OF HEAVY AIRTANKERS –
Some of the airtanker fleet may not be back this year. Billings has volunteered to look at having 2 medium size SEATs since their heavy airtanker will not be back. Grangeville will most likely lose their heavy as well.
Added NRTC into this agreement, agencies will receive credit for donating instructors.
NRCG needs to decide if they want to commit to purchasing 30 new computers for the IMTs. Will defer this decision to the spring meeting. Too many agencies are unsure of their 2003 budget and may be taking cuts.
Agencies need to confirm costs, especially on employees’ salaries and confirm with Starla.
This plan is approved with the exception of the decision on the new IMT computers. There is a realization that agency budgets are uncertain and some agencies may have trouble funding anything above fixed costs.
Next year the Wildfire Conference wants a couple of NRCG people to be on the steering committee. Would like to have a tribal or local gov’t person and Bryan will get an NPS employee. Conference will most likely be held in Wyoming in October of 2003. Get names to Tim by Thanksgiving.
New MOU is approved. NRCG will draft a letter to zone training reps outlining expectations of their role with the MOU and distributing the new MOU format. We will talk at IMT meetings about the acceptance of contractor qualification cards. John Specht will get update on status of ICQS.
NRCG will send a letter to NWCG in support of this program.
The decision to purchase hardware and software is deferred to spring meeting. The Geospatial Task Group should build a pool of GIS specialists available for fire assignment.
Charter approved. The committee meets next week in Billings. Tom Corbin will be the NRCG liaison.
NR SAFETY OFFICER – NRCG endorses driving as an emphasis item for 2003.
ACTION ITEMS:
2002-1 - If committees anticipate project that require funding, they need to submit a budget to Tracey Nimlos by the NRCG spring meeting for inclusion in the AFD Financial Operating Plan.
2002-2 - Business and Ops committees: Should contractors be in leadership positions, i.e., Division Group Supervisor?
2002-3 - Decide at Spring meeting if we will issue a letter saying our policy is not to stage IMTs more than 72 hours.
2002-4 - Reissue ENGB qualification letter with clarification. Send to contractor’s associations, MOU training providers, dispatch offices.